Modernism:
What does 'The Wasteland' mean?
1) how has it been interpreted? (cite examples)
2)what are some of the key features
3) In what way has it been influential
Post-Modernism
1) What common qualities do 'the beats' share? Why 'beats'?
2) How is beat poetry linked to rap?
3) How was Bob Dylan's 'Masters of War' involved in controversy during the Bush administration?
4) On what grounds was 'Howl' accused of being obscene - grounds for the defense?
5) What kind of protest song/rap other media have come out in the last decade? Is there a spirit of protest anymore?
sorry, guys.I haven't finished reading 'the Wasterland' but will post as soon as I finish it.
ReplyDeleteFirst reading through ‘The Waste Land’, I had difficulties understanding the poem because of many sudden changes in perspectives of different characters and the huge load of references that I never know of. Somehow, the lines reinforcing the topic gave me a glimpse of the idea that Eliot has an intense point of view regarding cultural loss.
ReplyDeleteEliot switches the speakers to unfold different narrating, telling what the speakers were going through. Leading readers’ assumption so as to bring the images created between lines closer to them. For instance, Levenson (1984) analyzed that readers might need to identify the role. Readers want to identify the ‘us’ that winter kept warm with the ‘us’ that summer surprised, and with the ‘we’ who stop, go on, drink coffee and talk (Levenson, 1984). Although the change of speakers, situations and images are unexpected while reading, somehow they gave me a direct impression of the emotion within the characters. Incidentally this style that Eliot proceeds speakers’ narrating reminds me of the movie aired in 2012 called “Cloud Atlas”. Scenes and location switch along with the introduction of different roles’ confession or assumption. However, every story branch differentiates with one another as much as echoes the theme. Also the formation of rhymes text is broken in the poem, which proved its influences in terms of modernism.
According to Levenson (1984), Eliot wrenched his poetry from the self-sufficiency of the single image and the single narrating consciousness and the principle of order in The Waste Land relies on a plurality of consciousness, an ever-increasing series of points of view that struggle towards an emergent unity and then continue to struggle past that unity. Obviously, Eliot integrated his personal experience during the First World War and unsatisfaction regarding literature (cultural) heritage (tradition) into his work. As far as I’m concerned, the title ‘The Waste Land’ implies the infertile place that culture and tradition could not ground upon. It can be clearly seen in the metaphor used in both ‘THE BURIAL OF THE DEAD’ and ‘DEATH By WATER’. Eliot (1922) wrote that
“And the dry stone no sound of water
......
Which are mountains of rock without water
If there were water we should stop and drink
Amongst the rock one cannot stop or think” (p.1, p.7)
From my point of view, water might symbolize concepts such as tradition and culture inheritance while rocks might symbolize barriers, which I reckon is related to the European culture ravage caused by First World War that Eliot observed.
References
Eliot, T. S. (1922). The Waster Land.
Levenson, M. (1984). A Genealogy of Modernism: A study of English literary doctrine. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press.
In the last decade protesting through media was popularly done with rap/music. Famous artists such as Eminem and Nas, one of the greatest rappers within the last 10 decades. Wired through music, these rappers express their thoughts of society racism however, not out of ignorance. The lyrics protest the unwanted stereotype that has been given to "black rappers" and also the unrecognized knowledge they attain "What influenced my raps? stick-ups and killing, kidnapping, project buildings, drug dealings criticize that, why is that? Cause Nas rap is compared to legitimate crap..." Here, the artists claims that the crime narrative in his music come from a genuine place however, respect skips him and he is categorized together with rappers that make mindless gangsta rap. The artist goes on to say "Hip Hop is dead" stating hip hop is dead because they, the artists, no longer have the power. This insight shows that the artist not only rap from the streets view but also a political view. He compares himself to historical artist such as Bob Dylan and Jimmy Loviness declaring his music is just as good if not better but because the perception that other mindless rappers have created, artist such as himself, who rap to raise awareness towards life, are caught up in that stereotype leaving their voice unheard. This view allows us to see that rap is another form of protesting to improve this unforgiving world. You can also see this view from Michel Jacksons song "We are the world" and "Heal the world".
ReplyDeleteEminem, another artist that has emerged from the same context with the same mind-set. Eminem, an artist who based majority of his compositions on his life style and conflict within his family ministered to many. It is artist like these that have grasped the tradition of rap and have used it to signify the racism, unnecessary violence, family violence, poverty etc that has evolved over time. I think it causes curiosity as to whether the government recognizes these issues or have these issues emerged from the perspective mindless rappers created. The spirit of protest is not as alive as it could have been if the sincere compositions were taken into consideration, if the power in rap music was still there. Nowadays, rappers such as Kanye West and Jay-Z claim to have power in music however, the music produced has no significant meaning behind it. The spirit of protest is slowly being replaced by sexual insults, as the critical reader states, it is an African tradition of warriors boasting about power, sex and all sorts of social commentary but it seems to me that sexual boasting has emerged dramatically and claimed its place at the top of every artist concept. Hip hop is a poem that tells a story however, that is slowly becoming a blur.
References
Hip Hop is Dead lyrics. Retrieved June 13, 2014, from http://rapgenius.com/Nas-hip-hop-is-dead-lyrics
ReplyDeleteSanneh, K. Nas Writes Hip-Hop’s Obituary. Retrieved June 13, 2014, from http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/14/arts/music/14sann.html?_r=0
Eminem: Like Toy Soldiers Meaning. Retrieved June 13, 2014, from http://www.lyricinterpretations.com/eminem/like-toy-soldiers
Ginserberg, A. (1995). On rap. US: Hibbet Radio
ReplyDeleteModernism struck me as being grim and foreboding before anyone even explained it to me during lecture times! So I wasn't at all eager to read or hear any of it, but then it struck me with a kind of understanding. These poets and writers are far from happy with the way the world is run and presented. Why, they were probably asking, is the world portrayed as a wonderful, bright and happy place when so many people are suffering with so few to help them? Little children like the chimney sweep in Songs of Experience, are suffering, yet many, including his own parents are turning a blind eye towards his pain, because, so far, he is still alive and he once in a while, manages to find some spare time to play and laugh, like all other children, but these happy times are overshadowed by darker, grimmer times, and most choose not to notice it. In regards to "The Wasteland" poem, It's quite shocking. For example, "lilacs out of the dead land"- lilacs, like most other flowers are thing of beauty and a symbol of life, why put it in a dead land? But then we may discover that the woman- although enjoying an activity such as sledding, is "German", moreover aristocratic, which means that she has suffered a great defeat- especially as some believe that she is a member of the Austro-Hungarian Imperial/Royal family, which had recently suffered a great loss and is now facing forced exile. She sees no happiness, no hope in her life and future, and becomes chillingly prophetic about the misery she foresees. I think this is a way of the poet showing then-unpopular sympathy to the nation and its people and royal family- and knowing that war affects not only the victors but the losers as well, innocent as well as guilty. This is an unspoken word against the allied forces and their people who had been unnecessarily hostile to the Central Powers, going so far as to even endanger the lives and property of anyone who had a German name. Modernism here shows a discontent- as previously stated- in the way others, including those in power, see the way the world is, and should be, run. "The Wasteland" shows the hopelessness people like the woman might feel, the misery and inner suffering. The title itself metaphorically conveys that there is no hope of joy to be seen growing in an imagined wasteland, which was what the woman must be feeling. The internet site SparkNotes, like many others believe that this may be one of the greatest modernist poems of all time, and like me, believes the woman to be an exiled royal, facing hopelessness and pain in her banishment.
ReplyDeleteBeats is similar to rap, because it mostly is rap, when taken out of page, put to a rhythm and spoken out loud in a beat. We all know that the administration of US president George W. Bush was a controversial one. Some saw him as a hero, others saw him as weak, easily misled, while others including Bob Dylan saw him as addicted to his own power, warmongering and unconcerned with the welfare of his own people, as shown in the "Masters of War" music video when a soldier who was returning from a long war to see his wife and children arrives home only to discover he is being sent out Front again, and a woman who has had a hard time making ends meet, learns that her family will be forcibly evicted from their flat at the same time her children watches t.v and sees that there will be tax cuts imposed by the president. Like Post-Modernists Dylan is clearly not happy with the way things are run during the Bush administration. He is using the music video and rap to not only convey his message and feelings about the government, but to also gain support for his opposition to Bush, whom he believes is draining the country financially and depriving people of families and home by use of war. So far I've seen little complaint during Barack Obama's time in Office, that sparks such a big controversy people are making music and poetry out of it, but as usual, not everyone is content. As for the poem "Howl" all I can say is that while anger may be justified and may have a right to be conveyed, speaking so bluntly about the ways people- Muslims I believe- are being harassed by the police, because of the way they looked- and the poet was not flattering about describing it- and the use of marijuana as being normal- if you read the poem. So it would come as no surprise if people saw it as extreme and obscene. It's also bad to smoke marijuana, even as being prejudiced is.
ReplyDeleteIt's funny how many protest songs in the US are about life in the Bush administration! People really had something against him! Besides that there is little. However as I happen to be somewhat supportive of Obama I can't really complain, can I? However there is a fantastic amount of Beats poetry, trap and songs written, especially in the US, during the time of George W. Bush. There have been songs written in New Zealand too, but only in the last century, about Nuclear testing in the Pacific.
ReplyDeleteI think rap was used as a tool to provoke Bush at the time. However, not just Bush but all leaders. If you think about it, the music realm is the best way to reel people in. Take Eminem or 2pac for example. Their lyrics are deep and are worth analysing because the concept of their songs were based on daily lifestyles or struggles. In a way this can also be seen as a protest, like I mentioned in my previous post. It can target social economic institutes and how they turn a blind eye to the 'struggle' the artist always rap about. Things like this force them to chaff and provoke the dominant groups. If you look at rap from the inside you will understand that their music is not just for entertainment but merely telling a sincere story.
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DeleteI hold the same opinion as rachel's. Rap lyrics could be kinda offensive and aggressive also dedicating to government to some extent, but they are trying to speak for the those people who are suffering from unsatisfying social phenomena. 'Protest' could be from the attitude but i don't think it is the goal to punch Bush or any other. I think they are trying to volume up the echoes from people to imply how the things should be fixed.
DeleteDo you think trying to volume up the echoes from people lead to violent remarks?
DeleteNot exactly. I don't think the lyrics tend to lead people somewhere and how they would be received is up to different opinions. Well probably some people might exaggerate the aggressiveness in lyrics to trigger the popular anger or something on purpose (I don't know why but some people do) but I would not say it is the goal of rap songs..
DeleteOf course that is not the goal but if you think about it, when someone is not heard things tend to lead to chaff remarks causing controversy. There are a few songs that provoke the dominant culture. What do you think?
DeleteYeah, I see what you mean. Just like what you said, if people tend to consider the songs as encouragement than they would be provocative. If some misunderstand or distort the idea of those lyrics, then pretty much it causes controversy. It depends on perspectives.
DeleteIts interesting how emotional rap songs are. do you think these emotions create a link between poems and rap?
Delete3) In what way has it been influential.
ReplyDeleteEliot is the most popular and influential poets of the 20th century (Simpson, 2007). In the history of literature, Eliot also has an important role in to settle Modernism in U.S. I think that he is like a pioneer of the Modernism . “The waste land” was sign of the beginning of modernism. He has a lot of literary talents and abilities. He applied his ability in his literary works: “The waste land” and so on. Also, He wrote not only Potteries but also other related genres. The work expressed the deepest side of the world excessively and it contributed to the growth of English literature. In addition, Eliot touched many writers heart by his works. Finally, Eliot is the father of modernism poets, and many writers can try to think of modernistic works by Eliot.
Reference
Simpson, A. G. (2007). Analysis of T.S. Eliot’s the waste land. Retrieved June 3, 2014, from http://voices.yahoo.com/analysis-ts-eliots-waste-land-594548.html
What does 'The Wasteland' mean?
ReplyDelete“The Waste Land first appeared in October, 1922, in the Criterion, a periodical founded and edited by Eliot (Simpson, 2007, para. 2). ‘The Wasteland’ means wilderness or badlands. There is no hope, no people, no animals and plant. That is, no one can live that environment. 'The Wasteland' is a very difficult poem. Maybe people who are first reading cannot understand at a time. There are many hidden meaning and symbol. Thus, there are many interpretation and conjecture. Thus, Readers have to think deeply and widely. I think for this reason make ‘The Wasteland’ to be a famous poem. ‘The wasteland’ consists of five sections which are "The Burial of the Dead", "A game of chess", "The fire Sermon", "Death by water" and "what the thunder said" (Naver blog. 2013). I think that in this poet, Eliot want to describe the human state of broken mind, weakness, struggle for life, lethargy, etc.
Reference
Naver blog. (2013). Why does call ‘The Wasteland’?. Retrieved June 3, 2014, from http://blog.naver.com/styx154/60188790025
Simpson, A. G. (2007). Analysis of T.S. Eliot’s the waste land. Retrieved June 3, 2014, from http://voices.yahoo.com/analysis-ts-eliots-waste-land-594548.html
If anyone know about the meaning of 'The Wasteland" more detail, please reply here. Thanks.
DeleteAccording to what I have read, "the waste land" symbolizes the pause of the development in literature and culture and the waste of tradition. Like its literal meaning, infertile. Nothing could be grown on the earth of literature.
DeleteYes, that`s a good information. I think there are another more meaning in 'The Wasteland'. It is like a onion. When I peel an onion, there is another peel again. Anyway those symbolizes meaning dark, bleak and gloomy.
Delete1) how has it been interpreted? (cite examples)
ReplyDeleteAccording to Thompson (1963), there are 3 levels of the interpretation of ‘The Wasteland’: the person, the society, and the human race. Firstly, the point of personal interpretation is that seeks to reveal Eliot's feelings and intentions in writing the poem. Then the society level may be interpreted a critic looks for the meaning of the poem in relation to the society. Finally, the human level is extension the societal level to include all human societies - past, present, and future. I think it is difficult poem, but read and read be getting interesting poem.
Reerence
Thompson, E. (1963). T.S. Eliot: The Metaphysical Perspective. Carbondale: Southern Illinois UP.
2)what are some of the key features
ReplyDeleteEliot uses diverse key features in ‘The Wasteland’ such as quotations and allusions. This is from previous writers who Shakespeare, Chaucer, Spenser, Dante, etc. For instance, he quotes 56 works including 36 writers and applies 6 languages and also added English. In addition, he applies scriptural writing. It means that Bible, Hindu Upanishad, Buddha`s Fire Sermon like religious colour and anthropological studies (Wikipedia, 2014). Moreover, Eliot uses “a variety of verse forms”, “a collage of poetic fragments” (Lewis, n.d.). I think that diverse features are adopted in ‘The Wasteland’ with harmoniously. Therefore, when I read his poem, I feel like the character of just for Eliot.
References
Lewis, P. (n.d.). The Waste Land. Retrieved Juner 5, 2014, from http://modernism.research.yale.edu/wiki/index.php/The_Waste_Land
Wikipedia (2014). The Waste Land. Retrieved June 5, 2014, from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Waste_Land#Structure